The Most Important Illustration in the History of Golf

[Bagger Lance]

Lessee - Yoda has asked to keep it civil, others would like to keep it civil.

I'll ask Daryl and Wedgie as well. If ya can't, I guess you'll have to put each other on ignore. But it would be nice to have you participate.

Differing opinions are welcome, but we have to change the tone. Internet communications are one of the worst. I think tin cans and strings would be more effective. Its impossible to know the "attitude" behind posts. It's why we have the smiley guys.

Carry on.
BTW, check out the lag and shaft bend on my smiley golf guy.

[wedgy]

Lessee - Yoda has asked to keep it civil, others would like to keep it civil.

I'll ask Daryl and Wedgie as well. If ya can't, I guess you'll have to put each other on ignore. But it would be nice to have you participate.

Differing opinions are welcome, but we have to change the tone. Internet communications are one of the worst. I think tin cans and strings would be more effective. Its impossible to know the "attitude" behind posts. It's why we have the smiley guys.

Carry on.
BTW, check out the lag and shaft bend on my smiley golf guy.

I'm on board and that smiley guy is out of control does he ever get tired...lol.

[chipingguru]

What about 6-c-2-c

"The prestressed Clubshaft will resist the weight of the ball during impact, instead of cushioning the impact with an unstressed clubshaft".

If he is referring to the Hogan type inward shaft lean, that is a peculiar way to phrase it.

On the other hand, the lag pressure remains throughout the swing, indicating it is present even when the club ultimately passes the hands and ,therefore, through the various shaft flex points. And 7-11, states clubhead lag deals exclusively with sweet spot plane. So, lag pressure and shaft flex are different animals.

To my untrained eye it is a little fuzzy.

[natep]

I think the cushioning is probably was happens most of the time. Have you ever hit a drive flush and had the sensation that the ball stayed on the face a little longer than usual? I think that sensation might be a result of the forward stressed shaft hitting the ball and bending the shaft back into a lagging clubhead orientation.

It might also be possible for an extremely strong individual to load the shaft in such a way with a particular acceleration profile so that the shaft never bends toward the target before impact.

[david sandridge]

There is some great information here in this thread - Don't miss that Wedgy. Those of us that believe in lag have a reason. We have seen it, we feel it and we know it works. Whether or not the shaft deflects in that fashion is probably not a helpful fact to hitting a golf ball. Now I would like the forums opinion as to whether swingin a club head on a rope would produce a similar deflection or swinging a "Whippy" club. I would have a hard time believing my "whippy" club shaft deflects in that manner......and I don't care. Now looking at the ball "line of sight" does the club head or hands get to the ball first? Wedgy are you saying the clubhead get ahead of the hands and arrives simultanously or head of the ball. Does the clubhead move ahead and then bet behind in the milliseconds before impact. Wedgy consider how many successful strikers of the ball believe in lag. it is a priniciple right or wrong that works - just like TGM literalism works for me. Just as science can interfere with treating patients I feel it can interfere with understanding and performing good golf swings

[O.B.Left]

Now I would like the forums opinion as to whether swingin a club head on a rope would produce a similar deflection or swinging a "Whippy" club.

The physics of the bends is beyond me but I do know that Lynn has mentioned the toe down bend of the clubhead on a rope. That CF wants to align the Sweetspot to the #3pp as seen below in a Homer demonstration. With a more rigid shaft , this tendency bends the shaft and toe down, such are the forces in play.

Note the natural Horizontal Hinging of this True Swinging procedure too. You can not manipulate the face when the shaft is a rope.

[JTillery]

The ball on the rope deal would show the same deflection eventually if a part of it had to slow to transfer momentum the way our bodies,arms, hands, sequentially do in a golf swing. If we could do the superman spin, maybe it wouldn't, but we are on our way to a finish and the ball/rope isn't. (Well until you decide this is the last spin )

Wedgy's right that the shaft defects the clubhead forward, which is useful to know for theory or club fitting, etc. However, for golfers and teachers, we better just keep sensing lag pressure point pressure. Ive seen enough videos of clubheads flying forward , so to that I'm with you David.

Maybe beating a dead horse beyond Yoda's post (#113 I think)

(A fitting signature......."try" to bend it)

[david sandridge]

I agree that knowing shaft deflection is great for clubmakers. When I was making clubs, because I was left handed and needed a test set, I must admit that I had 26 drivers in my garage less than three years old !! I had a frequency machine and deflection board. Years ago I was hitting my Calloway 7 wood so sweet. I went to the clubmaker at Martin's in Myrtle Beach. I asked if he could make a driver to frequency match it. He fiddled around with his components and said he didn't have what he needed in left handed. Then He had me hit my driver. I had just finished playing and was stiff and 95 mph was my best. He took my driver and swung left handed 120mph. Then He told me I didn't need a new driver but LESSONS ! I was pissed. Concepts like the shaft bending down and deflecting foward I think are best put in the recesses of your brain and forgotten. I have enough trouble with the foward leaning shaft and its illusions.