What do you think the point of swing left means? Do you believe it's a startdown to impact thought/concept/methodolgy??? Your thoughts?
Another question...Did this golfer personally study with the golf instructor who teaches this swing left approach or did this individual read a book that told him to swing left?
DG
Mainly, I think that it's a total misunderstanding of the geometry. People see the clubhead blur in a circle, so they attempt to draw circles instead of straight lines. Also, the circle seems to match a rotary motion. I asked him about his concepts. He spoke mostly about body power, turning hard to the left, etc. I think most of his information came from reading magazine articles and hearsay.
I've seen a mat that wanted you to trace a circle with a laser ("F" in geometry). Needless to say, Homer had it right about tracing the straight baseline. 2-J-3 shows us the visual equivalents. Simply placing balls on the ground to cover with the clubhead does not consider the geometric basis of the inclined plane. How would one decide the degree of curvature? There are no degrees of straight lines. Either you're tracing a straight line, or you're not. It's that simple.
You can't drop your hands straight down from the top, then rotate like a compass. The club goes down, out, and forward simultaneously and on-plane. They are not sequenced motions as some teach.
Mark Evershed uses a laser at the end of a club and he demonstrates tracing a straight plane line after impact with a bent right wrist. He explains the hands have to move left to keep the point of the laser on plane. He calls it swinging the hands left. Is this what we're talking about here?
Mark Evershed uses a laser at the end of a club and he demonstrates tracing a straight plane line after impact with a bent right wrist. He explains the hands have to move left to keep the point of the laser on plane. He calls it swinging the hands left. Is this what we're talking about here?
Based on Ted's comments, it appears the swing left is not coming from Evershed. The swing left concept that Mark teachs is acutally 1-L-15, a post impact condition.
Based on Ted's comments, it appears the swing left is not coming from Evershed. The swing left concept that Mark teachs is acutally 1-L-15, a post impact condition.
DG
I don't know. YodasLuke needs to explain himself better. Is he talking about Hardy? Manzella? Evershed? What does he think swinging left is?
I don't know. YodasLuke needs to explain himself better. Is he talking about Hardy? Manzella? Evershed? What does he think swinging left is?
Go ahead YodasLuke...
...thrill us with your acumen!
I think Ted has explained himself quite well. It is a modern golf axiom to swing to the left. Most have an OTT move- Outside to In to achieve this or swing the club around without a proper 3 Dimensional Incline Plane- just trace a circle with the clubhead on a ground line.
If you continue to trace a straight plane line with the Hands and have proper rhythm (TGM definition of course), the Pivot will move the hands to the inside-visually to the left. And without any independent Hand movement that this axiom wrong implies to many.
Forward? Good question DG. I don’t know. I think the linear motion to the ball was implied where as the Down and Out on Plane to Joe Duffer isn’t??
I think Ted has explained himself quite well. It is a modern golf axiom to swing to the left. Most have an OTT move- Outside to In to achieve this or swing the club around without a proper 3 Dimensional Incline Plane- just trace a circle with the clubhead on a ground line.
If you continue to trace a straight plane line with the Hands and have proper rhythm (TGM definition of course), the Pivot will move the hands to the inside-visually to the left. And without any independent Hand movement that this axiom wrong implies to many.
Forward? Good question DG. I don’t know. I think the linear motion to the ball was implied where as the Down and Out on Plane to Joe Duffer isn’t??
Thanks 6B,
It is the axiom that I find to be beneath contempt. I, honestly, could care less who teaches such things. I will not. It's frustrating enough for me to hear the things that people have been told (even more so when they can accomplish them). So, I know it's frustrating for someone like this guy that was pounding 7 irons 100 yards.
Not that anyone wants to take this a step further, but, the visual arc sharpens as the plane shallows. And, the visual arc straightens as the plane becomes steeper. Ultimately, it can become a visually straight line in the Angle of Approach Procedure.
The points are simply these:
1. Most see Low Point and Impact as the same thing.
2. Telling someone to swing left has no geometric basis and will encourage the bypassing of Low Point (encouraging for 1st point). But, if you'd like to encourage Roundhousing, it's an incomparable suggestion.
3. The degree of visual curvature is based in the steepness of the plane.
Thanks 6B,
It is the axiom that I find to be beneath contempt. I, honestly, could care less who teaches such things. I will not. It's frustrating enough for me to hear the things that people have been told (even more so when they can accomplish them). So, I know it's frustrating for someone like this guy that was pounding 7 irons 100 yards.
Not that anyone wants to take this a step further, but, the visual arc sharpens as the plane shallows. And, the visual arc straightens as the plane becomes steeper. Ultimately, it can become a visually straight line in the Angle of Approach Procedure.
The points are simply these:
1. Most see Low Point and Impact as the same thing.
2. Telling someone to swing left has no geometric basis and will encourage the bypassing of Low Point (encouraging for 1st point). But, if you'd like to encourage Roundhousing, it's an incomparable suggestion.
3. The degree of visual curvature is based in the steepness of the plane.
Nice 'un! Make the world go 'round in circles . . . make it fly high like a bird up in the sky.
Thanks 6B,
It is the axiom that I find to be beneath contempt. I, honestly, could care less who teaches such things. I will not. It's frustrating enough for me to hear the things that people have been told (even more so when they can accomplish them). So, I know it's frustrating for someone like this guy that was pounding 7 irons 100 yards.
Not that anyone wants to take this a step further, but, the visual arc sharpens as the plane shallows. And, the visual arc straightens as the plane becomes steeper. Ultimately, it can become a visually straight line in the Angle of Approach Procedure.
The points are simply these:
1. Most see Low Point and Impact as the same thing.
2. Telling someone to swing left has no geometric basis and will encourage the bypassing of Low Point (encouraging for 1st point). But, if you'd like to encourage Roundhousing, it's an incomparable suggestion.
3. The degree of visual curvature is based in the steepness of the plane.
Yoda,
Love this post!
#3 is very over looked when people say go left. Not to take away from the total view of what may work for a low handicap player who may get the low point ( I would hope)
I have seen a few of the guys from this camp of thought. But they always have sand on the SW from the left bunker.
Mainly, I think that it's a total misunderstanding of the geometry. People see the clubhead blur in a circle, so they attempt to draw circles instead of straight lines. Also, the circle seems to match a rotary motion. I asked him about his concepts. He spoke mostly about body power, turning hard to the left, etc. I think most of his information came from reading magazine articles and hearsay.
I've seen a mat that wanted you to trace a circle with a laser ("F" in geometry). Needless to say, Homer had it right about tracing the straight baseline. 2-J-3 shows us the visual equivalents. Simply placing balls on the ground to cover with the clubhead does not consider the geometric basis of the inclined plane. How would one decide the degree of curvature? There are no degrees of straight lines. Either you're tracing a straight line, or you're not. It's that simple.
You can't drop your hands straight down from the top, then rotate like a compass. The club goes down, out, and forward simultaneously and on-plane. They are not sequenced motions as some teach.
Ted,
Why doesn't 1-L-13 mention the word "Forward"???
And why does Homer mention the golf swing in this way in 12-5-0...."Use a slow, smooth motion up-and-back, down-and-out and up-and-in the same distance in both directions and continously as possible." No mention of forward there either???
DG
Last edited by Delaware Golf : 03-24-2007 at 11:46 PM.
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