[Mike O]

I trained my pivot with my hands. My pivot works for them. In no way does my body transport the hands on an unfamiliar pathway.

I can't see how I can be so wrong. If I am than I will not take up much of anyone's time and misguide them. It's best to just return to the pleasure of reading posts and learning what I can.

Mike,
First you need to understand that I am not on my medication- as Bucket would point out. Second, It's sometimes difficult to put yourself in the context of the writer- so I may have completly mis-interpreted the context of your post. Finally, you gotta take all this with a grain of salt if that's the right saying (I'm great at messing those things up)- everyone's got their own opinion or perspective- not really life or death here.

That said, My point was if a beginning student read post#9- I would think that on the procedural/operational/ "what am I trying to do here" level - they would focus on the pivot if they read your post and the hands if they read my post.

That intention to move your hands and the club is the christmas tree that everything else hangs on. It is the canvass that the artist uses to paint the painting. It is the basic. Everything else is just details.

If that still is confusing then specifically it's the word "let" as in "Let the pivot move the hands" - that to "ME" and possibly "ME" only- implies that you place your attention/intention on the pivot. Now, since this thread started with a reference to Ben Doyle- then I would add from my perspective that his approach and communication of the stroke- with the focus on the pivot- is the same that I am implying was in your post. Just in case you are or have learned from him. That's just not my approach.

To close in regards to your post here.
6BMIKE: "In no way does my body transport the hands on an unfamiliar pathway." From my perspective it's not only the path that they take but the method that creates that path. You could pick up a ball off the ground or hit a baseball with the hands traveling on a nice plane but you could have created that motion in an un-coordinated method. In other words, you could have picked the ball off the ground by focusing on and having your intention to create a certain amount of knee flex and waist bend.

6BMIKE: "I can't see how I can be so wrong. If I am than I will not take up much of anyone's time and misguide them. It's best to just return to the pleasure of reading posts and learning what I can."

I'd say the rule of the road would be - if you have the interest - then certainly share your knowledge. Now, If you (Not Mike O.) decide that some aspect of your knowledge needs to be upgraded, changed, etc. then you make that change and move on- continuing to share what you know and look to listen and improve. So as long as a person's intention is not to misguide then share, share, share. There is always going to be disagreements, sometimes those disagreements don't get settled because one or both sides can't communicate or understand the issues involved enough to arrive at a common understanding.

I'm always available off-line if you want to get a complete elaboration of the entire context of this topic matter.

Otherwise, do what Bucket does and run me over- then back the truck up and run me over again for good measure- and then when you have confirmed death- go out and shoot a smooth 67.