Air, you've found some of the greatest posts I've ever read. Thanks.
You're welcome. I guess you are one who can make use of them - more than I can. It is inspirational to see what there is to be found of wisdom. I'll dig some more...
In my 1982 G.S.E.M. class with Homer, we did indeed discuss the Frozen Right Wrist. But since you weren't there, let's do a little work and go to the dictionary. First, per definition #7 in my Webster, the word frozen means "arbitrarily kept at a fixed position." And, since that Frozen Right Wrist is flying as the G.O.L.F.er executes his Motion (Basic, Aquired, or Total per 12-5), you are correct in that the word implies a 'holding' type motion.
Originally Posted by Yoda
Originally Posted by Phillygolf
The question that needs to be asked is, how does one 'hold' the bent right wrist and still have some type of hinge action other then vertical?
In other words, is he simply identifying an alignment versus what a player be trying to do? - this question is only regarding the right wrist.
I ask - when I use pure aiming point (assuming I am onplane) and I really drive the ball into the ground, I sustain lag. When I try to 'hold' the right wrist, bent, inert - hinge action is completely nil.
Thanks.
Patrick
Patrick,
The Right Forearm Flying Wedge demands a Bent, Level and Motionless Right Wrist. Its precision assembly and alignment with the Left Arm Flying Wedge is the basic structure of the Power Package and is mandatory during the entire Stroke (6-B-3-0-1).
The Hinge Action concept (2-G; 1-L #4) is one of the Flat Left Wrist controlling the Clubface alignment through Impact (8-10). Its identity and function are totally distint from that of the Right Forearm Flying Wedge andits Bent Right Wrist. The Flat Left Wrist replicates the controlling Hinge Action Motion by staying vertical to one of three Basic Planes, i.e., horizontal, angled, or vertical. In so doing, the #3 Power Accumulator (the angle formed between the Left Forearm and Club per 6-B-3-0) seeks to maintainits radial alignment with that Flat Left Wrist Hinge Action Motion. Thus, the Flat Left Wrist controls not only the alignment of the Clubface but also the Rhythm of the Stroke (6-B-3-0 and Glossary).
The Aiming Point concept is one of aiming Lag Pressure Thrust (6-E-2).It enables the player to deliver his Loaded Lag Pressure to a desired particular point on the Delivery Line, i.e., the Geometric Plane Line or its Visual Equivalents (2-J-3). Once again, its identity and function are distinct from both the Flat Left Wrist and the Bent Right Wrist.
So, every Stroke must include each of the elements of your question:
(1) A Basic Power Package Structure that includes the Bent Right Wrist and whose alignments are maintained throughout the Stroke;
(2) A Hinge Action Motion replicated by the Flat Left Wrist and its complementary #3 Accumulator alignment and Rhythm;
(3) An Aiming Point (which replaces the Ball) to control Thrust Direction.
Your challenge is to integrate each of these into your Basic Pattern (12-1-0 or12-1-1) through the Three Stage Basic Motion Curriculum (12-5-0/1/2/3) while at the same time preserving their separate identities.
In Geometric Golf, there is no substitute.
__________________
Yoda
I understand for swingers, the left wrist action controls the clubhead, and the left hands controls closing and opening of the clubface. With dual horizontal hinging 10-10-D and standard wrist action 10-18-A. the left wrist uncocks and rolls through impact, and the left hand hinges horizontally to close the clubface.
My question is what is the right forearm and wrist doing? I had always assumed that the right wrist was rolling to match what the left hand and forearm was doing. This is common instruction on websites and books.
A wrist throw trigger 10-20-E says "the Right Hand remains palm-up to the Plane during the Uncocking of the Left Wrist to produce a sequenced release per 2-G and 4-D-0." In order to keep the flying wedge assembly and to keep the left wrist flat and uncocking, and to keep the right wrist bent and the right palm face up to the plane, the wrist has to turn??
For the past year, my right wrist had been rolling through impact. Could never understand the underhand pitching motion that was described doing it that way. But if I turn my right wrist on the downstroke and through impact, then it feels like an underhand pitching motion. AM i completely off base? I couldn't find a section in the Yellow Book which describes what the right wrist is doing through release and impact except for one sentence in 10-20-E, but it was a bit vague.
dee
Thanks.
Your first three analytical paragraphs are absolutely correct. You have done your homework and are to be congratulated for being 'on the money.'
You have accurately described the pure Swinging Motion. It features a Turned Left Wrist on the Backstroke; a 'Karate Chop' Uncocking Left Wrist fom the Top; a Swiveling Left Wrist from Release into Impact; the Full Roll Feel of Left Hand Horizontal Hinge Action to the Follow-Through (Both Arms Straight); and finally, the Left Wrist Swivel into the Finish. The Left Wrist is The Lord of the Grip, and therefore, as you have correctly observed, the Righ tWrist is a complement to these Left Wrist Actions. See the Useful Combinations 5-A/B/C/D.
So, you don't feel "Underhand Pitch Motion and Feel' doing all that Turning, Cocking, On Plane Karate Chopping, Uncocking, Swiveling, Rolling and Swiveling again?? I bring glad tidings...
Who would?
Nobody!
The 'Underhand Pitch' part of the Pure Swing -- which concentrates on the Left Wrist Action described above -- just ain't there!
Unless, of course, you can somehow sense the Feel of the Full Roll of Horizontal Hinge Action -- which is a 'No Roll' Feel on its own Horizontal Plane -- as an Underhand Pitch. But I seriously doubt you or anyone else can, because the fact is that it Feels like a Full Roll on the Angled Plane of Motion.
So, where's the disconnect between what you are able to Feel and what Homer is describing in 2-N-0? Here's the key:
You must focus on your Right Forearm Flying Wedge (6-B-3-0-1). When you do, you will see that its On Plane Right Forearm and its Bent Right Wrist and its No. 3 Pressure Point and its Rigid Clubshaft Extension moves through Impact as a Paddlewheel (6-B-1-0). The straightening of the Right Elbow -- under the command of the Left Arm Checkrein Action -- powers, guides and regulates the No. 3 Accumulator (Left Forearm and Clubshaft Angle) and with it the Clubhead Closing through Impact.
Even though the Left Wrist precisely aligns the Swinger's Clubface for Horizontal Hinging, the Paddlewheel Action of the Right Forearm is there. Per 4-D-0, the Swinger concentrates on Wrist Action and the Hitter concentrates on Hand Action. If you want to sense Underhand Pitch, Motion and Feel, you must focus on Right Arm and Frozen Bent Right Wrist Paddlewheel Action, not the Swinger's Uncocking, Swiveling and Rolling Left Wrist Action.
Here's how to do that:
Get your Sand Wedge (or, better yet, a wooden dowel you can buy in any hardware store [48" X 1/4" diameter]). Grip it with your Right Hand only (in its normal position on the Shaft). Go to Fix. Body shifted Left and Pivot Zeroed out. Right Wrist Bent with Shaft leaning forward ('against the Ball'). Now, keeping your Right Wrist Bent, take the Club up with a Bending Right Elbow and Magical Right Forearm Takeaway (7-3). Go no further Back than Right Forearm Level to the ground (Acquired Motion 12-5-2). Better yet, stop at Basic Motion, two feet back per 12-5-1. Then, go through no further than knee high (12-5-1 or waist high (12-5-2).
Check your Right Wrist. It has Flattened, right? Well, it should not have! It should still be Bent! Do this one-arm drill over and over again until you can go from your initial Fix position Bent Right Wrist to the Top to the end of the Follow-Through with your Right Wrist still Bent. Hit the first fifty Balls in your next five practice sessions with just your Right Arm Flying Wedge. No more than about 20-25 yards. That's all! No Gold Stars for distance! Gold Stars for finishing with a Bent Right Wrist at the end of your Follow-Through (Both Arms Straight Position). In other words, per 4-D-1, you must learn to Straighten your Right Arm without Flattening your Right Wrist. Practice also with your dowel on the Horizontal Plane per my post last night ('Keeping You Busy') in the Five Steps To A Magical Right Forearm Flying Wedge thread. As you learn to do this, you will suddenly find that you Feel...
Been reading 3-F-5 and find myself in need of a lighthouse icon_redface.gif
From what I gather, the "practice stroke" is primarily to practice the pivot motion of the body, while not overly focusing on the arms or hands. Basically establish the plane line and your position relative to it.
"Forward press" sounds like fixating the clubhead/shaft relations at impact, i.e. flying wedges. Mostly hand and wrist positions
What I don't understand is what is the "start down" waggle and the "address" waggle. Is it like what Mike Weir does (start down) and what Ben Hogan explained (address)?
Most serious golfers are reasonably aware of the pre-Shot fundamentals of Grip,Stance and Posture. And even though these could almost always be improved, they are at least familiar. Similarly, golfers are keenly aware of the Address(Station 1), the Start Up and the Backstroke. That is because they spend a great deal of time on their 'move' to the Top (Station 2). Most practice the wrong things, of course -- "Start back with the Shoulder Turn and keep the Club low to the ground" comes immediately to mind -- but at least they are aware of what is going on. But, once they get to the Top, this studied awareness fades to black: The mind flashes Code Red, all Hell breaks loose --AAOOOGA! AAOOOGA! DIVE! DIVE! -- and they find themselves suddenly at the Finish (Station 3), usually asking the proverbial question: "What have I done?"
The problem here is that almost all golfers have at least some idea of what is going on in their Stroke from Address to the Top, but only a very few have any idea what is going on from the Top to the Finish. In The Golfing Machine, this is called Downstroke Blackout, and its cure is the Downstroke Waggle (3-F-5). Use it to practice your 'move' from the Top: Downplane through the Start-Down and Downstroke. Downplane through the Release and Impact. Downplane to the End of the Follow-Through (Both Arms Straight position) and even into the Finish. Move continuously -- up and back and down and out and up and back and down and out -- through these various sections of the Stroke, integrating and overlapping them as you do.
Through diligent practice, you will in time substitute precision motions and alignments for what is presently only a very fuzzy idea of what happens between Stations 2 and 3. Your Downstroke -- and remember, that includes the Follow-Through (only the Finish should be considered the Upstroke) -- will have been correctly programmed.
Regarding the Address Waggle, the Golfing Machine Waggle is not the 'Handsy' action you see when people attempt the 'Hogan' Waggle. This type of Waggle -- usually a fiery, Wristy move of the Clubhead away from and back to the Ball -- is almost always accomplished by Bending and Flattening the Right Wrist, Cocking and Uncocking the Left Wrist, and holding the Arms relatively motionless. In contrast, the Golfing Machine Waggle is an Arms Waggle-- the Right Arm Bending and Straightening and the Left Arm Swinging from a Motionless Left Shoulder -- with the Right Wrist Frozen in its Bent, Level and Vertical Impact Alignment and the Left Wrist Locked in its Flat, Level and Vertical Impact Alignment. And always over the top of the Ball.
Use the Golfing Machine Waggle to rehearse the Bending of your Right Arm in the On Plane Right Forearm Flying Wedge Start Up. Feel the Extensor Action of your Right Triceps and the accompanying Checkrein Action of your Left Arm as you move up, back and in On Plane and down, out and forward On Plane. Feel the Lag Load against the #3 Pressure Point at the Top of the Waggle. Feel its Drive through the Impact Interval. Feel the Straightening of your Right Arm and watch its actuation of the #3 Accumulator Roll. Watch the Clubhead Blur over the Inside-Aft Quadrant of the Ball as you execute the proper Left Hand Hinge Action and Rhythm. Make sure you take your Waggle to the end of the Follow-Through, the Both Arms Straight position, even for a two-inch Putt. Through it all, maintain the Impact Alignments of your Left and Right Wrists and Trace the Straight Plane Line with your Right Forearm and #3 Pressure Point.
If it sounds like there’s a whole lot going on in this Waggling business,you’re right. Quoting Homer:
“You’re a very busy guy!”
But don't worry, once you've consciously Translated the correct Mechanics into reliable subconscious Feels (1-J and 3-B), simply go through your Routine before each Shot. It takes just seconds, and the only time you will be interrupted is when it doesn't 'Feel' right. Something is mechanically not as it should be. Your Early Warning Waggle System has done its job, and you have been alerted in time to save the Shot.
Program your Impact Alignments at Impact Fix (8-2). Practice your Waggles at Address (8-3). Use your entire Pre-shot Routine (3-F-5) to help you be as prepared as possible before Start Up, as precise as possible to the Top, and as smooth and complete as possible through Impact to the proper position at the Finish. With a disciplined Pre-Shot Routine, you'll seldom need a 'do-over:'
At the end of the day, the question that really needs to be asked is:
Given the Patterns that Homer has provided us, the product of more that forty years of scientific research and experimentation, why would we just not take the Patterns as provided and then customize only as necessary? And for the most part, those customizations will only be to meet the specialized need of the Shot at hand, e.g., a Putt versus a Drive.
Originally Posted by Yoda
Originally Posted by tgmgolfer2k2
People aren't big fans of this. You aren't supposed to fit in the molds of the two basic patterns given in 12-1-0 and 12-2-0. As Chuck would say, you're supposedly to build your own, not follow someone else's. The patterns given in 12-1-0 and 12-2-0 may or may not be ideal.
A quick question about the Swinger's "pulling" you mentioned - can the Swinger, from the top, just drive their right shoulder into PP4...hang on...and turn through it? Is that a viable feel option? [All Yoda's Bold.]
1. People should be 'big fans of this.' If they think they can do better, particularly at less than the truly expert stage, I categorically state that they are wrong.
2. The Stroke Patterns of 12-1-0 and 12-2-0 are ideal. Any deviation from them will result in a loss of power or accuracy or both. With the possible exception of making the Power Package Release Automatic -- which is what the Tour Players spend most of their waking lives trying to get right -- and also, adding the No. 4 Power Accumulator to the Hitter's Component No. 4 (Stroke --Variation) to produce a Four Barrel Stroke (10-4-D), the player should accept them for genius they represent. The wheel has been invented already. Use it!
3. The Right Shoulder Turn Thrust (6-B-4-A and 10-13-D) in the Start Down (8-7) is a key move for both Swingers and Hitters. And it should be mastered -- programmed -- consciously. At the programming stage, I wouldn't think so much of driving the Right Shoulder "into the No. 4 Pressure Point," as I would driving the Right Shoulder straight against the Ball. When you do this you will Feel your Left Arm Load -- weld! -- against the No. 4 Pressure Point (6-C-1-#4) and the Lag Pressure Load -- weld! -- against your sensitive Right Forefinger No. 3 Pressure Point (6-C-1-#3). Having first Loaded the Power Package, your Right Shoulder now has the second of its "dual" functions to perform, namely, Transporting the Loaded Power Package Down Plane for Release -- Sequenced (Swingers) or Simultaneus (Hitters) per 4-D-0.
So, from the Top, Swingers should Load, then let'er rip! "Blast" the Left Arm toward Impact (2-M-4). Hitters, once that Right Arm has been accelerated, should start Driving it -- with its priceless Bent Right Wrist -- through Impact. And don't Quit, because Mother Nature -- Centrifugal Force -- ain't around to help you out. You must keep driving...or else be prepared to watch your Shot fall a Club of two short of your target.
As soon as the Mechanic of the Right Shoulder Thrust has been identified and reduced to its Feel Equivalent (1-J) and fully integrated into your Total Motion (3-B), be sure to turn the whole operation over to your Hands. It is they that must trace the correct Stroke Geometry through the Three Stations -- Address, Top and Finish.
Continuing to focus on the Right Shoulder once its correct Action has been properly programmed leads to Pivot Controlled Hands, the antithesis of The Golfing Machine's Hand Controlled Pivot.
Please tell me if I'm stuck on a reef in the fog. From what I understand, at impact, the sweetspot of the clubface must be slightly inside of the target line and pointing right of the target line in order that the clubface be square to target at separation and for the sweetspot be along the target line at separation (2-C-1 #3). For the hitter, the angle of approach is used; for the swinger the arc of approach. Both the swinger and the hitter impact the ball at the same location, but from different paths. So at impact fix, the clubface is slightly open and the ball is towards the toe.
How does one find that location on the ball? and also how open should the clubface be?
Your on the right track, rchang72. You're learning your lessons well!
Looking down at the Ball, visualize cross-hairs through it directly down and across the Target Line. Assuming the Target is North, the Inside-Aft Quadrant is the Southwest Quadrant.
Regarding the Open Clubface alignment at Fix, try this experiment to help you understand why Horizontal Hinging demands it and approximately how much is required:
Grip the Club with your Left Wrist Flat and Vertical. Then raise your arm directly in front of your Left Shoulder and parallel to the ground. Verify that the toe of the Club is pointing directly at the sky. If it is not, adjust it until it does. Now swing your arm in front of you (like a hinged gate) until it is directly over the back of the Ball (positioned for Straight away Flight).Finally, without changing your Flat and Vertical Left Wrist in the slightest, lower your arm until the Clubface is soled behind the Ball. You will find that it is slightly open.
The idea is that with Horizontal Hinging, the Clubface is always Closing through Impact, and that Motion must be accommodated in the Impact Fix Alignment. For the 'light' Shots -- Putts and short Chips -- the Impact Interval is so short that very little Clubface adjustment is required. In other words, the Ball does not stay on the Clubface long enough for the Closing Motion to affect it. So, on Short Shots -- for all Hinge Actions -- a Square Clubface at Fix is all that is required. [This information is not 'in the book' but was taken directly from Homer's recorded discussion of this point.]
However, the opposite is true for the extended Impact Interval of longer shots. For Horizontal Hinging, the Clubface has longer to Close, and it must therefore be aligned more and more Open as the shots get longer. For Angled Hinging, the Clubface should be aligned more and more Closed to compensate for the inherent Slice tendency.
The degree of Clubface 'Open' or 'Close' will vary for each Club and length of Shot. And this can only be determined through experimentation. As a guide to this trial and error process, Homer offered this advice:
Horizontal Hinge Action
Horizontal Plane of Motion
Hinge Pin Vertical (Perpendicular) to the Horizontal Plane
Vertical Hinge Action
Vertical Plane of Motion
Hinge Pin Vertical (Perpendicular) to the Vertical Plane
Angled Hinge Action
Angled Plane of Motion
Hinge Pin Vertical (Perpendicular) to an Angled Plane
Okay, Martee. Terrific pictures! I've edited the captions in your Quote above and they are now "picture perfect!" They will help everybody a lot.
Now, in your PM, your thought was that the vertical hinge action (#2 photo) requires a Horizontal pin. And I can clearly see where you are coming from: The pin is aligned horizontally if you view it only in relation to itself. Clearly, the pin is horizontal.
But...here's the key:
We're not looking at it that way! We're looking at the pin in relation to its associated Plane of Motion. In this case, that is the verticalplane of motion. And relative to that plane, the pin is vertical, or to use your very good word, perpendicular, to the vertical plane of motion. [As a matter of fact, 'perpendicular is so good that I'm going to edit my post to use it instead of the 'at right angles' to. Same thing, of course, but better said.]
So, no matter which of the Three Basic Planes of Motion is illustrated, the hinge pin is always vertical to its associated plane:
-- Vertical to the horizontal plane;
-- Vertical to the vertical plane;
-- Vertical to the angled plane.
The pin is never horizontal to any one of the three planes. It is always vertical! All you do to achieve any one of the three basic planes of motion is to mount the hinge pin vertical to the plane of motion desired.
Do you see it now? This is a really important point because pretty soon we'll be learning to use our Flat Left Wristto duplicate the motion of a hinge by keeping it vertical to one of these three basic planes.
Okay,so I finally get in tonight, and I've got to tell you, the above posts just'kill me!' So close and yet so far!
The simple truth is that we swing according to our concepts, and unfortunately, most of our concepts -- courtesy of the Golf World -- are wrong! Why do you think there are so many poor players? More to the point, why are there so many truly dedicated players who have 'hit the wall?' No matter what they 'do' or what they 'know,' they just can't make any real progress!
The core concepts of The Golfing Machine are simple once understood. You know their names: Stroke Geometry. Centrifugal Force. Lag Pressure Point. Hinge Action. Plane Line Tracing. Flying Wedges. Hitting -- Axe Handle! Swinging -- Rope Handle! Maybe you even know what they mean! But knowing what to do, and then actually doing it, are two totally different things!
Said Pogo:
"We have seen the enemy. And it is us!"
The Golf Stroke is all about inscribing near-perfect Circles with the orbiting Clubhead on the face of an Inclined Plane-- while simultaneously Sustaining Lag Pressure on the Clubshaft and controlling the Clubface through Impact.
You may read that last sentence again. You might even want to write it down and memorize it.
There are easier things in life! Still, there is little I couldn't show a reasonably coordinated ten-year old in a very short period of time. Especially if I didn't have to get him out of a ton of very expensively educated Bad Habits. And by the way, that is all most Golf 'Swings' really are anyway: An amalgamation of Bad Habits that daily execute their own ignorance.
It takes me an hour to write a simple prescription that I could show you in two minutes. And even then, there is so much more I want to say. I want to scream:
"Can you guys just all come over to my house for a couple of hours? I'll show you The Big Deals -- what really needs to be done -- and we'll talk about it. Soon, it will all come together and makesense. Or at least enough to keep you busy for awhile."
But obviously, that's not in the cards.
So, what to do?
For me, this weekend will involve some reasonably seriousphoto shoots. You just have to have it. It is too hard without it -- for both of us -- and too simple with it. And maybe some video. That's what we really need. I don't know the capabilities of the website technology or your ownhardware/software configuration. But the Big Deal is that you need to watch me do these things. Once you see them demonstrated, you are that much closer to being able to Translate these precision G.O.L.F. Mechanics into your own G.O.L.F. Feel System. Simple as that.
Or maybe the answer is just a 'homespun' no-frills video and you guys cover my costs. I don't care.
All I know is that it is driving me nuts that I know what you need to know and need to do and you don't. And something -- namely, my time and the current medium -- is big-time in the way.
There is an answer. I'm looking...and I would appreciateit if you would post your suggestions. Thanks.
.................................................. .................................................. .......................
I guess the link is found - and not missing any more - since this was written.
My first contact with Homer Kelley was by telephone in the summer of 1981. And the reason for that contact was simple: I had begun studying The Book, and there was no way I could figure out what that woman in 10-10 was doing with all that armor on her arm and shoulder! Well, by the grace of God and with Homer's help, I finally got it.
Unfortunately, present day Seekers do not have the advantage I did. And that is why I am now posting on this site. I suspect that many of you "out there" are in the same predicament now as I was"way back then." If that is the case, then this is your chance!
Don't hold back because you are new to The Golfing Machine, or because you are not yet comfortable with "the lingo, "or because you spend your site time merely lurking about, trying to make sense of it all. Get involved! As Homer would say, "Fly at it!" You can't believe how ignorant I was at one time with this stuff! Homer had me -- by telephone mind you -- Pivoting my body first to the right and then to the left; moving my Arm first North, then South; all the while keeping my Flat Left Wrist vertical first to "this" Plane and then to that one. After 45 minutes or so, we mutually decided that maybe we should just give it a rest and try again later!
The Hinge Action is one the Three Imperatives and is responsible for the Clubface Alignment through Impact. Pretty important, wouldn't you say? You need to understand this upside down, backwards and forwards, and inside out. When that's done, we can move on to something else. [For example, the Clubhead Lag, which I've found almost nobody truly understands. They think they do, but they don't. But that will be a separate thread.]
So, once and for all, let's clear The Fog on this subject. I'll soon write a reasonably definitive post, and to help me do this, I want you to tell me, by posting on this thread what questions you have about Hinge Action that you want answered. All I ask is that you write cleanly and neatly and be definitive in your questions. I don't want to have to decipher your posts.
After I get a handle on the "Fog Level," I'll write my piece and we'll go from there.
All ahead 1/3, this starship is leaving the station!
Linear Mode
