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7-23 paragraph 3

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Old 02-13-2011, 02:42 PM
HungryBear HungryBear is offline
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7-23 paragraph 3
The Golfing Machine - edition 6 - 7-23 paragraph 3

“The Straight Line Path is a simpler procedure than the Angled Line Path. But the latter is a very natural movement and has the advantage of the true Elbow Plane through impact. The former can have a steeper-than –normal Elbow Plane compensated with a reaching-out of the arms and a shifting of the Left Hand Grip that places the Clubshaft in the cup of the Hand instead of under the heel of the Hand, and the Right Hand Grip adjusted to correspond. ……..”
Reference - 7-23, paragraph 3

Discussion? "other" clarification by Ref.? etc.?

These are Homer Kelleys words and appear to me clear in meaning.

HB
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Old 02-13-2011, 09:00 PM
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BerntR BerntR is offline
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Thank you HB,

For some reason I haven't noticed that paragraph before. They appear clear in meaning to me too.

This is what I read from it:

TSP is geometrically better while plane shift to the true elbow plane is geometrically more complicated but enables a more natural movement through impact.
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Old 02-13-2011, 09:19 PM
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Daryti Daryti is offline
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"But the latter is a very natural movement, ...." was deleted in Edition 7. Which is correct?
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Old 02-13-2011, 09:34 PM
O.B.Left O.B.Left is offline
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Thanks for this Bear. Great question.

Ive always wondered if the quote in questions was more reflective of Homers thinking from earlier editions than his later ones.... wondered if it was an unrevised hold over from earlier days. I say this because I believe that in the end Homer had a preference for the TSP and not shifting down to the lower elbow planes.

Also the quote would appear to reference a zero shift procedure via the so called "theoretical" Left Shoulder Plane, with zeroed number 3 angle , the left arm on the inclined plane in other words. A procedure that would eliminate any roll power of the #3 accumulator. Not so good for full shots.

Me, I like the way Brian Gay does it ........what ever you want to call that. MInimal shift from a low TSP to a higher elbow plane or zero shift with him riding a low TSP/high Elbow combo all the way. And a good old fashioned grip with the butt end under the heal pad, Hogan style......no zeroing of the #3 angle in other words.

Im kinda thinking the glossaries definition of Pivot is at odds with the notion of a mechanical advantage derived from the right forearm being at right angles to the spine ....... but I could be wrong , again.

Id like to hear the answer to your question if Yoda or someone else knows ....... great topic. Got my pencil waiting so i can make a notation on that page.

ob
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Old 02-13-2011, 09:38 PM
HungryBear HungryBear is offline
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Originally Posted by Daryti View Post
"But the latter is a very natural movement, ...." was deleted in Edition 7. Which is correct?
If that is so it is also an inconsequential edit.
HB
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Old 02-13-2011, 09:40 PM
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Perhaps Yoda can also shed a light on why Homer developed a preference for TSP eventually. He must have learned something that made him change his mind. Something that made it equally natural to use the TSP.
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Old 02-14-2011, 11:33 AM
HungryBear HungryBear is offline
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"Higher Planes"
Originally Posted by O.B.Left View Post
... I believe that in the end Homer had a preference for the TSP and not shifting down to the lower elbow planes.


ob
Yes, My good neighbor.

I did not see any explicit Ref. to TSP only implicit Ref to "more upright" plane. And I do see explicit Ref. to Elbow Plane with an implicit range of "compensations" to accommodate an EP as it is established off the "more upright" planes.
I cannot remember where Homer Kelley stated a preference for a component variation beyond the geometry for its accommodation.
But I could have missed it so if anyone has a specific Ref. I would appreciate seeing it.

I do see 7-23 par. 3 as significant alignment discussion.

The Bear
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Old 02-14-2011, 03:07 PM
O.B.Left O.B.Left is offline
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Originally Posted by HungryBear View Post
Yes, My good neighbor.

I did not see any explicit Ref. to TSP only implicit Ref to "more upright" plane. And I do see explicit Ref. to Elbow Plane with an implicit range of "compensations" to accommodate an EP as it is established off the "more upright" planes.
I cannot remember where Homer Kelley stated a preference for a component variation beyond the geometry for its accommodation.
But I could have missed it so if anyone has a specific Ref. I would appreciate seeing it.

I do see 7-23 par. 3 as significant alignment discussion.

The Bear

I think the zeroed #3 angle implies Left Shoulder Plane......zero shift , no #3 accumulator..............no roll power as theres no clubhead travel. Thats the thing that strikes me as ungolf like , why swing a driver with the grip running through the life line? Double Barrel? Is that it? Underpowered but simple and effective maybe to Homer's mind back then. Im not familiar with his early editions and the double barrel pattern or patterns.

Whereas in 12-2 in my 6th edition, he specifies .....Strong Single Action grip, Triple Barrel (2/3/4) , Turned Shoulder Plane and Zero Shift. A different animal all together. One that requires a Low TSP/high Elbow combo plane as I read it/define it anyways. How you define things makes a big difference here too.......Can an elbow plane be a TSP at the same time for instance? Is there a range of Elbow Plane Angles? Im using the "range of angles" definition for both TSP and Elbow Planes so they can meet up. Like in the photo accompanying the TSP 10-6-B #1.


Glad you brought this up.

Last edited by O.B.Left : 02-14-2011 at 03:18 PM.
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Old 02-14-2011, 03:55 PM
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Daryl Daryl is offline
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Originally Posted by O.B.Left View Post
I think the zeroed #3 angle implies Left Shoulder Plane......zero shift , no #3 accumulator..............no roll power as theres no clubhead travel. Thats the thing that strikes me as ungolf like ..............
How about using this procedure for Chipping? or Putting?
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Old 02-14-2011, 05:24 PM
HungryBear HungryBear is offline
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Are we lost??
Gentlemen,
Let's re-remind ourself that I have quoted from 7-23 par. 3, this is delivery path, hands. I have only used Homer Kelley's words. My own, personal, feeling is that I am comfortable. But I also will not put my own words behind it until it has been analized by others.

The Bear
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