Can you Hit but still feel CF in the clubhead?
 

Last summer, I went to the dark side and experimented hitting :evilpumpkin: .

I did a few basic and acquired motion sessions to get the feel of it then took what I did on the course for a few weeks.
Amazing results:

• I shot my best score ever at 2 over par :eyes: ! (I'm 13hcp!),
• Accuracy was like a laser, especially in the short game area,
• Distance control in chipping/pitching was very reliable

and most pleasing, I experienced a huge improvement in distance (I remember also hitting my longest drives ever :-D).

But I was confused by what I felt and what I knew about hitting and thought I was wrong (despite the results!) and went back to swinging but never found the same magic and repeatability hitting has provided to me.

So now I'll give it another try but need some help to clear the fog:

Let me explain what I did last summer and what confused me:

1. Address at impact fix "ala Yoda's Luke"
2. Take the left arm flying wedge back in one piece (feeling no roll/swivel), using my right arm until my left arm goes across my chest.
3. 2-M-4 - Body Power: A violent but starting gently (!) Pivot Thrust to load the power package (a strong pressure is then felt into PP#4) then blast the left arm flying wedge out of my chest without doing anything at this moment with the right arm (very important!)
4. Only and only when the power package starts to blow of my chest (the feeling of PP#4 decreasing) I activate my right arm to supply additional power and drive everything down to the ground.
5. All this produced a no-roll feel with angled hinge.

What confused me here is that when you use the blast of the left arm of your chest using 2-M-4 you FEEL the clubhead accelerating and you feel centrifugal force.
At that time I thought I was mixing because I was feeling CF!!!

But now, I think I misconfused the effect for the cause:

• Cause of the swinging power: Centrifugal force.
• Cause of the hitting power: Muscular force (not necessarily the right arm only, right?)

Effects for both: The clubhead accelerating in a circular motion. From then, physics dictates that there is CF in the clubhead!

Is it normal to feel that while hitting or am I missing something?
Can anyone confirm that?

4 barrel
 

What you describe sounds just like 4 barrel hitting to me. You wont be a 13 handicap for long is my guess.........if you can putt too

Hitters drive (push) the entire club- shaft and clubhead through the ball. There is no whirl- no arc of approach but an ANGLE of approach.

"Cause" and "Effect"
 

The "intent of Hitting" is the "Cause" and the "Feel" is the "Effect".

You either feel what you intend to do and feel or don't feel.

From 3 barrel to 4 barrel
 

Yes Thom, it makes sense now you’ve said it:
During the last year, I learned to feel clubhead lag using pressure points in the hands and tracing:
I improved my ball contact and consistency a lot (better compression, divots well after the ball...).

But as my focus was mainly to educate my hands, I paid little attention to the pivot.

Boy! I understand why Homer said the pivot is the Master Accumulator (6-B-4-0):

I have always been a long hitter, and very few people can overdrive me, but putting the emphasis on the pivot provided even much more power (awesome!) and a lot of comfort (a bit less effort)!!!

By consciously adding the #4 accumulator into play (full strokes) everything fell in place: I distinctly felt the Checkrein action (pivot, shoulder, arms, club...) and every ounce of power I can generate was applied to the ball with the clubhead weighting a ton :thumright!

Luke, do you feel the (Centrifugal) Force?
 

Agreed 6bmike, this is exactly what I "see": the angle of approach line crossing the target line and going to right field... and it's working well.

Now, quoting 2-M-4: "...consider Pivot Thrust as Body Power blasting a Swinger's essentially inert Left Arm into orbit toward Impact, or as supplying the initial acceleration of the Hitter's loaded Power Package so the Clubhead can be endowed with Pivot speed PLUS Right Triceps Speed",
don't you think that, even if the Hitter doesn't whirl the clubhead, he feels the clubhead accelerating and feels CF as an incidence of the motion just created???

It's not me, it's physics: I think that hitting or swinging (different sources of power), the clubhead moves in an orbit around the shoulder hinge. And everything orbiting has Centrifugal Force.

Thus, we should feel that resulting CF while hitting, right?!

It would be nice if an accomplished 4 barrel hitter like TED could describe if he feels that (Luke, do you feel the (Centrifugal) Force? :) ).

Not physics- geometry. the clubhead still moves in a circle except the whole radius of the club is pushed. The clubhead is not whirled. Like beating a carpet on a clothes line instead of whirling a rock on a string. CF needs greater throw-out- a quick move from the start. A hitter plots his course. There is no CF in lower throw-out speeds. Muscle power only. A batering ram instead of a catapolt. CF is uncontrolable- you give up control to the forces of Newton. Hitters maintain control and push/drive the club to low point. Swingers live on the edge of throw-away. Their only control is propr mechanics of the gryo- right shoulder thrust.

so...
 

ExtensorMike - if he feels CF while hitting, he's actually right arm svinging??:eyes:

..or will it be possible to feel CF from the top to release, and then confound drive out lag pressure with CF lag pressure into impact??

Yodeli is saying that he feels CF while hitting, does anyone have an explanation/TGM interpretation?

Yodasluke ?
 

I think that Yodasluke has written in differents threads that he is a four barrels hitter, and start the downswing with a "swinger feeling" in PP#4.
Start like a swinger and then push like a hitter ?

Feel like a swinger startdown then push like a hitter
 

Exactly my feeling!

PP4 blasts of my left arm from my chest - it feels like a swinger startdown - BUT as soon as ACC#4 releases, I "catch the momentum" and add more power to the motion by strongly drive the whole unit (arm+club) down and out to the ground.
The power produced by this procedure is amazing and I think it explains why Ted drasticaly increased the lenght of his shots!

I certify that my clubface is producing angled hinging with the distinctive no-roll feel.

I could also SWING using the same startdown (using PP4 to blast the left arm of the chest) but I will whirl the clubhead to impact instead of driving it.
The result is a distinctive horizontal hinging with a full-roll feel.

So to summup things:

• For me, Hitting or Swinging, the blast of the left arm from the chest using PP4 is the same - So are the feelings AT THIS MOMENT of the swing.
• Then ONLY at ACC#4 release, the different feels between hitting and swinging happen.